Vimeo HD

Vimeo HD now has 720p support. So users with HD cameras can upload their footage in 720p HD format. It looks fabulous, have a look here and go full screen with it.

I have a few problems with the whole thing though: they seem to re-encode at 24fps, even if you shot in 60i. For God’s sake, re-encode NTSC HD video at 29.97 fps, not 24 (unless it’s shot at 24). And I really, REALLY, hope that when they say “24 fps”, they actually mean 23.976, which is the correct IVTC 24p frame rate. Because if I record with my HV20 true progressive 24p at 23.976 (after removing pulldown) and these guys are re-encoding at 24fps instead after I upload my footage, they will mess up the A/V sync real good.

Also, make sure you do the following four things, like YouTube correctly does it:
1. De-interlace the material, if the uploaded footage is not de-interlaced, many users don’t know how to de-interlace (yes, youtube is able to detect and correct that).
2. If the audio is mono (which is very common if the videographer used an external microphone), re-encode as stereo.
3. Support WMV as Sony Vegas Movie Studio does not support any other HD “delivery format”, so users of Vegas won’t have another option.
4. Recognize and respect aspect ratios.

It’s little things like that this that still bring some value to Youtube: actual engineering. Although I must say, Vimeo looks promising to videographers like myself.


Justin wrote on October 27th, 2007 at 7:11 PM PST:

we’re capped at 24fps right now because of the limitations of VP6. since it’s a cap, every frame rate up to 24 stays native, including 23.976. 30 is coming soon (and yes, 29.97).

some quick responses to your list: 1) we do deinterlace (videos with deinterlacing errors almost always have them before being uploading.) 2) reencoding mono audio in stereo is pointless, it doesn’t add any information and just makes the size of audio twice as big. our HD video has stereo audio (youtube is mono for everything.) 3) we support WMV. 4) we recognize, respect, and even love aspect ratios.

did you try uploading something? some of that actual engineering you missed might be revealed through actual research 😉

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Eugenia wrote on October 27th, 2007 at 7:18 PM PST:

Justin, thanks for the reply.

Making mono as stereo is not pointless, because audio recorded with a mono mic will only come out from one speaker. While most NLEs have a way to select the “left channel”, iMovie doesn’t, and most consumers don’t have a clue about it either. I think it’s important to get a mono part of a video and make it stereo, while leaving the rest natively stereo.

Regarding WMV, I heard reports that you don’t support it. I highly suggest you try out WMV that comes out of Sony Vegas which is the NLE of choice for the new breed of videographers lately.

>did you try uploading something?

Will do so next week. I want to re-edit some of my footage for Vimeo specifically.

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Eugenia wrote on October 27th, 2007 at 7:54 PM PST:

Justin, I can confirm the WMV problems. The problem is with the audio. If you listen carefully, there are some eeeek sounds in the video, while there are not on the original. Check my short video above to hear the problem. The original was encoded with Sony Vegas’s WMV 720p template.

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Eugenia wrote on October 27th, 2007 at 8:05 PM PST:

One more problem I have is that the on-screen widgets take too long to get out of the way once the video is started and the mouse is away from the video (I counted a 5 full seconds). I’d like the widgets to disappear in about 1 to 2 seconds later.

Justin wrote on October 27th, 2007 at 8:55 PM PST:

Now we’re talking 🙂

dalas v wrote on October 27th, 2007 at 10:42 PM PST:

The “eek” sounds might be audio clipping errors. Do you have a level meter in your editing program you can look at? When audio clips, strange things can happen.

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Eugenia wrote on October 28th, 2007 at 12:02 AM PST:

I find my way around video, but I don’t now much about audio. But you guys have the original, so please do have a look. 🙂

Jorge wrote on October 28th, 2007 at 7:26 AM PST:

Thanks for the tip. Hmmmm full-screen doesn’t work here on Firefox/Linux (using latest flash plugin). I click “Full Screen” on the lower-right side and nothing happens. Is it just me or not? 🙁

Jorge wrote on October 28th, 2007 at 12:48 PM PST:

Ok, got it working. It doesn’t work with the latest “official” release (9.0.48) but it does work with the latest beta (9.0.64) available thru “Adobe Labs” here:

Adobe Labs Flash 9

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Eugenia wrote on October 28th, 2007 at 12:49 PM PST:

Yeah, I use the beta too, because of h.264 support.

Ivan wrote on October 29th, 2007 at 10:01 PM PST:

I have a widescreen video

As you can see, it is letterboxed, while your widescreen project is not. How do I avoid this? Is it because I live in a PAL area?
In Vegas Movie Studio, I have the setting ‘non letterboxed’. Tweaking it either results in letterbox, or sqeezed footage. What should I do?

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Eugenia wrote on October 29th, 2007 at 11:47 PM PST:

It is letterboxed because your video is not HD. You must export and upload in 720p in order to get the HD version of the Vimeo player. Otherwise, you get the 4:3 version of the player.

More over, I am pretty angry now at Justin. He said that Vimeo actually de-interlaces, but as your footage shows, Vimeo *DOES NOT* de-interlace.

As for you Ivan, 😉 you should not be using MPEG for online stuff because MPEG/mpeg2 does not compress well and as you can see, you end up with all these de-interlacing artifacts on video sites. If you don’t want to use WMV that Vegas supports (because it takes forever to encode in WMV), you can use my ffmpeg tutorial to export to other formats that are appropriate for the web. MPEG is not.

When I upload to Youtube and don’t want to WMV or ffmpeg, I simply export in the “PSP 1 Mbps full screen” template and that’s good enough. Small filesize, fast encoding, not bad result.

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Eugenia wrote on October 30th, 2007 at 12:09 AM PST:

Ivan, I downloaded your original video, the one you used to upload the video, and it was letterboxed already! You must check the vegas export checkbox that reads “do not letterbox”. Either that, or use a format that has the “custom” button enabled, like WMV.

Ivan wrote on October 30th, 2007 at 1:15 AM PST:

When I check the vegas export checkbox ‘do not letterbox’, my video is squeezed to 4:3 ratio… This is so for vimeo, and also for Youtube. It was online like that for a moment, but then I took it offline again. Should have kept it online.
Could it be because I’m using VMS 6 (not 8)?
Other vimeo files in non hd do NOT have letterbox, so why do I?

Also, VMS6 doesn’t have the psp template, nor does it have HD. :-((
I’ll do a wmv render right now and upload it to vimeo.

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Eugenia wrote on October 30th, 2007 at 1:23 AM PST:

Yes, try WMV. Export as 720×432 in order to keep the right 16:9 aspect ratio. If that doesn’t do it either, you must use my ffmpeg tutorial to export to various codecs/resolutions, otherwise you will have to buy VMS8. And make sure you use “progressive scan”, don’t let it interlaced again!

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Eugenia wrote on October 30th, 2007 at 2:11 AM PST:

Ivan, I saw your latest video. You didn’t use “interpolation” as the deinterlacing method which creates better quality on fast motion, and you didn’t export as 720×432 as I said above, with result to have this stretch problem. Use 2 mbps for video bitrate VBR, don’t use “quality 90” thing that doesn’t give you a a clear idea of what you are getting.

Please retry the way I suggest and you will get a better result.

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